Price to pay for helping Matters of the Heart [Archive]

colins

14-10-2008, 07:12 PM

I was introduced to a bro (Bro A) by another bro (Bro B) who have been trying to help him through his misery about mistrusting a prc girl. Apparently Bro A got to know a prc WL and was KC big time. Ok the usual story follows and he was in deep shit over both career and life. In summary, he still continually yearns for her and that was why Bro B went in to try to cure his disillusioned state.

2 other friends of Bro B both gave bad review on Bro A. They basically washed hands. Bro B then asked me if this guy can be helped, I replied no harm trying, any improvement will be an improvement cos he is so very 'down-there' now. So we met up for a couple of coffee sessions and proceeded to use both hard and soft means of pushing and pulling him away from his then current state. Bro B went to the point of introducing another girl to Bro A, and started to teach him the arts of KC. So Bro A now knows Singer C and finally went for supper with her once. I sort of supported Bro B's effort using my usual subtle ways by giving encouragement and providing an insight on what Bro A lacks.

Things were in order until Bro B heard the news from Bro A about his prc girl wanted to return to sg and was asking Bro A for money (for air tickets). Bro A seemed to be devastated, saying his demon is finally coming back, Bro B then teached him the steps to counter this and the mentality that should be employed against the effects of KC.

On the 3rd day since the news arrived, Bro B said Bro A is fucked big time and he wanted to give up all contacts with Bro A. When I probed further, Bro B told me Bro A was again trying to escape reality by doing heavy boozing, something that he did when his girl first left him. Bro B was thoroughly disappointed and intended to cut off all communications with Bro A. After hearing this, I called Bro A and got the same story. I said can you not go and deceive yourself and why after so much talk, you still decide to put this KC upon yourself?

I told Bro B, let me try and help him. He still got hope, maybe just weak-willed but let's look deeper into his character and see where are the holes to patch. Bro B thought for a while and said if you go, I will go. So we arranged one online session and another coffee session. The next day, I told Bro A my assessment of him and told him how he can help himself. Bro B graciously entered into the online conversation (well he is the sort who mean what he said about leaving Bro A alone) and both of us were doing our best to push him along. Through sideline conversations, I told Bro B that I've decided that setting a goal would be proper in helping him, in the end the only person who can really help him is himself. So we placed a bet - all of us get a girl (non WL or anyone from nightscene) to a dinner set 2 weeks later.

The purpose of this bet was to help him rebuild his self confidence and create a drive to work towards it. The prize was, both Bro B and I will coordinate and give him his best chance to get this girl, in helping him do all manners of wooing and lastly to give him all respect he should deserve during the dinner to help his chance with his girl. Either way, whether he really do bring a girl or not, he would have benefitted from the whole exercise. At the last note, Bro B suggested the failure to meet this bet is to pay for the dinner. Fair enough.

The coffee session came after a week into the bet. I remembered it was raining heavily that night during coffee, I just came off from a drink, limping (need to walk with a tongkat at that time) in the rain to catch a cab. When Bro B and I reached, Bro A said he won't be coming. The cab fare would be too expensive. I withheld an explosion (thinking of the money he hung for Singer C) and calmly told him to come, cos everybody was there waiting. Bro A finally came, and we started our session until well after midnight. We originally planned this meeting as a followup to see Bro A's progress and to give him support and help to meet the challenge. Bro A made no progress, so we suggested place to go, things to do and how to meet a girl. After the session, Bro B told me, aiyah cannot make it liao, he himself dun wan to help
himself, he will just run away from his problem just like he did all this while. I suggested patience.

So came that night of dinner. Bro B and I met for coffee couple of hours before dinner so we can have a chat and see the girls whom we would be bringing. The girls came and among the chattings, Bro B, with his own suspicion in his mind, suggested that I should contact Bro A. No one picked up his mobile. After a while, Bro A called and said he would be late, his mum was sick and his constant attention was required.

Bro B flipped and said see I told you. I said patience again, Bro A said he would be late for a while only, he will sms me in a while like he said he would. Bro B gave me a disgusted look and said if his excuse become yours, then you are fucked. Dinner went on and we started to have fun (but thats beyond this story la).

True enough, Bro A never called or sms again. Bro B later explained, he hasn't solved his first problem, which is to overcome himself to meet the challenge, the first act of escapism (from his own lack of self confidence) enables him to escape this meeting and everything else he does from now on will still be to escape, dun expect him to call anymore or see him on msn. I said I have learnt that there are some people which you can never help, if you do it can only bring you down. I suggested that maybe money was a concern to him and that he knew he couldn't pay and there started a fresh round of escape. So I am willing to lose the bet on his behalf. We were cool for a while until Bro B found out that Bro A had invited Singer C on that same night of dinner bet and actually sms her to contemplate 卖场 for the last session, in order to go for a drink at Boat Quay. So what happened to mum? What happened to the excuse of not having enough money? Worst thing was, Singer C was so annoyed with his sms to her saying that 如果我帮你卖场你要怎么报答我. So Singer C predictably decided to wash both hands and stop communicating with him.

colins

14-10-2008, 07:14 PM

Yesterday, I called Bro A for 2 purposes. First explain my effort, second collect my dues. I said, when I issued the challenge, I treated you like a bro and my intention had been very clear and you accepted it. We already said very openly, if no money tell us, if no girl tell us, if got any problem tell us. In my mind, I am prepared to pay for the dinner, even cab fare to return the girl back home. I did not ask if he has a job for no purpose. You choose to let yourself down when all you need to do is to help yourself or at least appear before us. We will probably laugh about it but we still treat you like a bro as long as you show some effort. Time after time, there were so many chances and yet you want to be the person who stays home and rot. I ended by saying just return me the money and let's quit this thing altogether. If there is anything that can help you, it is not the richest person in the world, it is yourself.

I related this experience for several purposes actually. Well since I've learnt a lesson I might as well share it. For many occasions in the forum, we see a bro in need and we stretch our hands out. Some bros may decide that they can just fuck the poor fellow and call him names. Some bros just entertain themselves. But those who are genuine in helping must assess if that help is asked for, if not necessary. We are all running our busy lives and sometimes we see a purpose to drop a little things on hand to pull someone up. Now I believe that the purpose must also be reciprocated. Else you might just worsen the situation or create some hole for yourself to step into.

Thank you for reading this long post.

xyz1001

14-10-2008, 10:03 PM

Bro colin, must really salute your patience.

To me, the person must have the will to help himself and i must see some good nature in him. Bro A is at the edge of the cliff already. There are thousands of excuses to think of but lying abt mum sick is like cursing her.

Recently, my fren A2, is in similar situation. My good fren and me has been trying to meet him after he came back from SZ. But he refused to meet us. Like that how to help him? Currently, we think he should have wipe up his saving, hope he will not run into credits debt or do silly things like selling house.

DO_YOU_BJ

14-10-2008, 11:05 PM

When wanting to help one person, for watever reasons, one must ascertain a very important virtue.
That the person in need of helping is deserving.
Sincerity must be felt in order for help to come true.
One's WILL decides one fate.
Helping someone is selflessness, thus very tiring and also, means, even through such BETRAYALS, does one stop helping?
Guess depending on who's the helper and who's the helpee
Well, me aint no saint or holy man.
I'll help but there's a limit.
If i sense insincerity from the other party, i'll walk away & buy the popcorn to see the end.

Bro Colins & XYZ, you have stretched out your hand, but in the event it causes your hands to be amputated, FUCK IT! Let the mutha fuka burn.......

Like i said in a post, some were born to screw, some were born to be screwed.
They've chosen their path so be it. You have initiated to help, thus even wif this intention you'll receive merits for this life...dun worry.....
After all, at the end of the day, if they peril at their own hand, it wont affect you the slightest bit rite.......you'll still sleep peacefully at nite! I know i will:D

ekemono

14-10-2008, 11:35 PM

Bro Collins,

Read your encounters and I admire your kindness extended to that particular bro. However, I hope you can understand that reciprocation is never part of the package in helping someone, or even to the extend, loving someone.
As long as your heart tells you it is the right thing to do, then do it without expecting anything. It will make you feel better.

From what I have read, you have done your part fully, and it is what matters. In life we cannot expect another person to response accordingly to our due effort. If right now you dun feel you owe anyone anything, you are good. :)

siopu99

15-10-2008, 12:30 AM

Bro Colins,

Sigh... you good man... going through great efforts to try to help Bro A.

But alas.... sigh and double sigh...

There's one thing I always believe in...

"you can't help a person who doesn't want to be helped"

If Bro A doesn't see the shit hole he is digging for himself and chooses to stay in it with his feet rooted in, using elephants also can't pull him out.

Only when the pain is painful enough will he see his shitty situation. Help him at that point when he asked for help. It will be more worth the efforts and easier too.

Maybe Bro A kenna kong tao?? or he too tao kong?? Only he knows.

I salute you and Bro B for all the efforts put in to help a bro in need.

Wooden_Handle

15-10-2008, 01:51 AM

Bro colins, you deserved the recognition in helping the poorer one, but sometimes they may not noticed their own state, and they are still living in their dream world. Please keep trying and never give up, cos I think 1 day he will be in even worst mess emotionally.

To lighten this thread up, I got a real story for a laugh:
There is this patient went for emergency dept after office hour with relatives, the care-giver examined him and prescribed necessary medicine. The next evening the care-giver on duty again and met the same patient, asked him why come again, and did he take the medicine, he said yes, but not working cos the medicine was different color from what he used to take. The care-giver was shocked but recovered and take out the leaftlets of tablets available and asked the patient to choose, finally after long discussion they settled something similar and he didnt see the patient again the next evening.

Therefore, I think its quite hard to really guage the human mind, their thoughts and it will need the time and patience to get them open up at the right instance.

colins

15-10-2008, 04:00 AM

Ah bros...thank you for your kind words and encouragements. To be fair, the thread is more to bring about an understanding towards people who needs help. The details are there so you can make a judgement and come to your conclusion. Actually the main purpose comes from my believe that when a hand is stretched out for help, it has to be looked upon. The only point I was stressing on is that a limit should be created based on what you can do, and also (now that I realised) what this person can do.

To say that I wasn't affected is a lie. Putting down all these in words is my closure, so now I can carry on knowing more and that has to be shared with all. Personally, I encourage the spirit of helping one another, not that it has to be reciprocated in kind (as bro eke said), but it has to be reciprocated with an effort. All I need to see is that there should be some level of determination in trying to solve his own problem. You can only push the horse to the water, you can't pump the water into the horse.

The source of this belief, is when I had problems some time ago, nobody came to my help. I din ask for it actually. How nice it would be to have somebody there to give me clarity, the sufferings would have been much less. Recently I just gone thru another bout of problems but Bro B was there. You can't imagine the difference between both. One relationship was 9 months long and this relationship was 4 years. In retrospect, this recent problem was much much more easier to go thru, although the feelings involved is a lot deeper. I can sleep with a smile on the day of discovering the betrayal, and I din apply any mind or action for revenge. If this can be the way more bros solve their problems, we can use it and teach everybody. This is what I am after.

DO_YOU_BJ

15-10-2008, 04:10 AM

Recently I just gone thru another bout of problems but Bro B was there. You can't imagine the difference between both. One relationship was 9 months long and this relationship was 4 years. In retrospect, this recent problem was much much more easier to go thru, although the feelings involved is a lot deeper. I can sleep with a smile on the day of discovering the betrayal, and I din apply any mind or action for revenge. If this can be the way more bros solve their problems, we can use it and teach everybody. This is what I am after.

A clear mind is a dangerous mind!
Welcome to the world of the clear minded:p

colins

15-10-2008, 05:32 AM

A clear mind is a dangerous mind!
Welcome to the world of the clear minded:p

Thank you, bro DYBJ. Not there yet, but the feeling is GOOD!

Thanks bro wooden handle for your interesting story, yes your point abt requiring time and patience to open them up is very true.

Thanks bro siopu99, I like your point in saying that a person needs a pain so painful that it will force him to change. Sometimes you'll see a person choosing not to see the light and pretend that something else had happen. This in actual fact is also a form of self preservation required to survive in this world. However, if this continue to happen a few times, the person will just gain the immunity to accept shit after shit. Until a time when this person do not know how to stand up for himself, he lost all hope of succeeding in anything he wants to do. This is wasting a life.

Thanks bro eke, yes a closure is good. I have never exited from a friendship before. And probably against Bro B's good wishes I can still say to Bro A, that anytime you want a listening ear, I am here. I have no expectation of him and wish him well. Btw, reciprocation of my effort means that he must come out with a willingness to help himself, the rest is unimportant cos I am doing this becos I want to do it, not becos I am working as a paid counsellor.

Thanks bro xyz, as usual you are clearer than me, you know you need to see a good nature in that person. Maybe for your friend, you guys should wipe out his savings yourself, then after this shit is over, give everything back to him. haha juz kidding ok.

cheers bros

xyz1001

15-10-2008, 06:58 AM

However, if this continue to happen a few times, the person will just gain the immunity to accept shit after shit. Until a time when this person do not know how to stand up for himself, he lost all hope of succeeding in anything he wants to do. This is wasting a life.

This happens when one allows fate to push him around. And it will continue to push until he is able to determine his self worth, his belief. Life is never fair at one time but is fair all the time. Bro A has no one to blame for his life to be so messed up becoz he ALLOW that to happen, he allow himself to be pushed around. So he can quit complaining.

Maybe for your friend, you guys should wipe out his savings yourself, then after this shit is over, give everything back to him. haha juz kidding ok.

The fee is never too expensive if he remember and learn from this experience, for there are still many many years that he can live life fullest.

Cheers :)

aczeta76

15-10-2008, 08:59 AM

Bro Colin...

Kudos to you and your friend for lending a hand to fallen bros..

A lot of people like to escape into similar problems and cycles as they fear different things. Some like Bro DYBJ said are "犯贱“ and they juz like the feelings of being treated like that.

To those people, if u are too nice to them, their auto reaction is to become more shitty to you as they cannot tahan the good things people do to them... machiam like they do not deserve it.

Being a bro and helping is one thing, like the PRCs WL, many need help but we have limited time and resources so we have to make sure we spend these on those who deserve our "investment"

To a good % of bros here, they are all thinking adults and at all times there is this little nagging thought in their minds which already tells them wat they want to do

So they will selectively hear only the "good things" they want too.... worst, your friendship to them may not mean anything sometimes.

So...be kind with an open eye.

ekemono

15-10-2008, 09:06 AM

A clear mind is a dangerous mind!
Welcome to the world of the clear minded:p

Didn't follow up much on this statement so I got a bit lost there.
Am I in the right direction to say that it is about detaching ourselves emotionally that may hinder our logical thinking, face and accept the facts and move on in the direction for our own interest?

pewpew

15-10-2008, 09:41 AM

DTCEPL

15-10-2008, 09:59 AM

A clear mind is a dangerous mind!
Welcome to the world of the clear minded:p

Another version for your consideration:

A clear mind is a HORNY mind

A mess-up mind is a KC-ed mind

The above applicable in SBF context lah:rolleyes:

Hiaz....life is always filled with uncertainty, how nice if we can always see whats ahead and plan or be ready for it.

slider_72

15-10-2008, 10:35 AM

WOOHOO

15-10-2008, 11:32 AM

bro colins
me WOOHOO need help too can help me bo??^^

colins

15-10-2008, 11:52 AM

This happens when one allows fate to push him around. And it will continue to push until he is able to determine his self worth, his belief. Life is never fair at one time but is fair all the time. Bro A has no one to blame for his life to be so messed up becoz he ALLOW that to happen, he allow himself to be pushed around. So he can quit complaining.

A lot of people like to escape into similar problems and cycles as they fear different things. Some like Bro DYBJ said are "犯贱“ and they juz like the feelings of being treated like that.

To those people, if u are too nice to them, their auto reaction is to become more shitty to you as they cannot tahan the good things people do to them... machiam like they do not deserve it.

Thanks for your insight over this point. Our self-confidence do play a big part in our expectation of the ways we are being treated. It is quite sad to see that some of us avoid confrontation becos we do not have the tools to protect ourselves. Further down this road, they just give up. No matter how you want to poke their pride and make them wake up, you can't pierce thru the layers of protection they built around it. Its not wall of protection, but wall of fats. On the flip side, they themselves can't even use that pride anymore, all they know is to defend themselves, deflecting hurt by escaping from reality.

colins

15-10-2008, 11:57 AM

Sometime, you tried to protect your buddies from being harm, in return you will get nothing but setbacks.

Just remember, true buddies are hard to find so... Even if there are road blocks inbetween the process of helping, hope you can keep trying.

Reason = Buddies

Actually, my approach is never to try to protect. It might cause more harm. Once the pride is pierced, self confidence can be rebuilt. That is where I am coming from.

If there is no expectation, there will be no setbacks. You need to be stronger and clearer than the person that you are trying to help. No expectations, no disappointments, knowing these will keep you going.

FL Lover

15-10-2008, 12:04 PM

Put it this way, there are some people who deserved to be helped and some who don't. There are people who appreciate you for lending your helping hand and those who bite the hand that feeds them. End of the day, it is your own conscience that holds you.

I for one really appreciated your words of wisdom when I was down in the past. Now I'm still in the game but hopefully as the predator and not the prey. Hahaha.

Bro, sometimes we need to let someone to fall down and learn from his pains. I always believe that if someone choose to remain in his own world while ignoring those who cared abt him... he does not deserve to be helped by others.

When I was down in my early stage of cheonging, I did not seek help from any bros here. I too able to stand up and live a good life after that. So the conclusion, if a person had made up his mind, he can do it. If he does not want to be helped, there is nothing u can do. Best you can do is to watch him fall, come to SBF to complain how WLs or KTV gers had cheated him of his $$ and career. No pain, No gain. Part and parcel of life. That's experiences.

There are many things that we need to accomplish in this world rather than sex and gers. TS, ask yor friend to give it a thought. Another sad case.

PS, I am a frank person. It is just a view on this issue. Seen too many such sad stories.

colins

15-10-2008, 12:19 PM

Put it this way, there are some people who deserved to be helped and some who don't. There are people who appreciate you for lending your helping hand and those who bite the hand that feeds them. End of the day, it is your own conscience that holds you.

I for one really appreciated your words of wisdom when I was down in the past. Now I'm still in the game but hopefully as the predator and not the prey. Hahaha.

Bro slider, you for one, has a lot of wisdom in you. I am just a volunteer, on standby to listen and lend a brain. Yours is an easy case cos you already know where you are heading. The rest is just a matter of time.

Predator and prey, I think before we know which class we belong to, we must first understand this statement - one man's rise is another man's demise. Predator and prey dun stay and live together, confrontation is always short and that is only necessary to devour the prey. After that the predator searches for his next meal, that prey ceased to exist in his world.

colins

15-10-2008, 12:50 PM

bro colins
me WOOHOO need help too can help me bo??^^

hahaha bro woohoo, if you also got a case, I need to refer you to the Jedi Council liao, cos it must be a really really big issue if you also can't solve.

xyz1001

15-10-2008, 01:33 PM

When I was down in my early stage of cheonging, I did not seek help from any bros here. I too able to stand up and live a good life after that. So the conclusion, if a person had made up his mind, he can do it. If he does not want to be helped, there is nothing u can do. Best you can do is to watch him fall, come to SBF to complain how WLs or KTV gers had cheated him of his $$ and career. No pain, No gain. Part and parcel of life. That's experiences.

Agreed, that is life experiences. But experience comes in different forms. Bro u can stand up on your own without seeking help becoz ur mind is strong, u are suppose to be able to do it. But there are others who needed help to pass this stage. I believe pple and pple meet for a reason. If bro A is strong enough, bro B and colins wouldn't be there. (of course, there might be some other reasons but is for them to find out too)

If bros can still come back to SBF and complain, that's good. At least they survived and learnt. Some just disappear, too deeply hurt to recover, some didn't make it back. We never know what happened to them, btw how many TS disappear?

colins

15-10-2008, 01:47 PM

If bros can still come back to SBF and complain, that's good. At least they survived and learnt. Some just disappear, too deeply hurt to recover, some didn't make it back. We never know what happened to them, btw how many TS disappear?

Insightful. And how many TS come and share their recovery?

FL Lover

15-10-2008, 02:12 PM

Insightful. And how many TS come and share their recovery?

Hahaha... Its all depends on the person himself. If he choose to believe whatever the ger said then god bless him.

It is beyond what TS can do for his friend. He is too deep into the KC. No way you can wake him up from there unless he gets the fall.

Just think back when we got into our FIRST KC by WLs, we also dont listen or refuse to listen to all those who tried to help us initalliy until we got hurt emotionally or when $$ got suck dry by WLs.

Same thing now. Whatever you have done for your friend, you have already done your part. The rest, MAY THE GOD GUIDE HIM TOWARDS THE LIGTH...:p

kyooky

15-10-2008, 04:32 PM

Bros Colin, u had already put in your afforts to help....it's more than enough........let the river flow it's path.
Everyone has it own path of road to go.

slider_72

15-10-2008, 06:47 PM

Predator and prey, I think before we know which class we belong to, we must first understand this statement - one man's rise is another man's demise. Predator and prey dun stay and live together, confrontation is always short and that is only necessary to devour the prey. After that the predator searches for his next meal, that prey ceased to exist in his world.

Errr, Bro, that statement is a bit too profound for me to understand. Maybe next time we meet for teh tarik you can explain further.

DO_YOU_BJ

15-10-2008, 10:07 PM

Didn't follow up much on this statement so I got a bit lost there.
Am I in the right direction to say that it is about detaching ourselves emotionally that may hinder our logical thinking, face and accept the facts and move on in the direction for our own interest?

This means, when we face anything, and i mean anything in our daily life, we have to take a step back at everything and examine, study & analyse the whole pic bit by bit to fulfill the complete pic.
If one's mind is preoccupied with things like how he/she wants the thing to be, EXPECTATIONS, HOPE etc, they will delude themselves into a believer thus lowering their mental state and defenses.
A clearminded person does not live in a world of hope.
He lives in a word of TOTAL clarity, thus seeing a plot even before the 1st stage is set upon him or her.
He/she controls the situation & thus, is able to dictate and break how things go and how things will happen to him/her before it even happens.
Becos he/she is clear, he/she can read a person totally inside out without the person revealing much, thus eyes like can peer thru steel.
Nothing escapes the eyes of a clear minded one.
This is what a Clear Headed Minded person is all about.
People like these are rare, have few friends....namely, you either love them or hate them, cos to the common folk, a clear minded individual is a clear and present danger to them. Thus they'll stay away!!!!

DO_YOU_BJ

15-10-2008, 10:10 PM

Hiaz....life is always filled with uncertainty, how nice if we can always see whats ahead and plan or be ready for it.

It's possible. Like i explained to bro ekemono.
If you really meditate on this, you'll be surprised how you can see the ending of things even now!
Go try it, you'll be a new person that you will never want to leave once you mastered this.

colins

16-10-2008, 01:32 AM

Errr, Bro, that statement is a bit too profound for me to understand. Maybe next time we meet for teh tarik you can explain further.

Take it easy bro, remember our last session when I prompted you a question? If from tomorrow onwards, I ask you to stop all contact with the girl whom you are dating (and suitably KC-ed), what will be your answer?

Your answer actually determines whether you are predator or a prey.

slider_72

16-10-2008, 10:30 AM

Take it easy bro, remember our last session when I prompted you a question? If from tomorrow onwards, I ask you to stop all contact with the girl whom you are dating (and suitably KC-ed), what will be your answer?

Your answer actually determines whether you are predator or a prey.

Hmmm.... food for thought.

Anyway the girl that I am dating now is going back at the end of next week. The funny thing is that I feel that I like her more than and get along with her much better than the previous girl from Chongqing, but somehow I am already mentally prepared to cut this off once she leaves. For sure I will miss her once she leaves but I am also sure that it would not affect me the way it did when the previous girl from Chongqing left.

Lets meet up for teh tarik again after my current girlfriend leaves and we can conduct a post-mortem. Maybe by collecting sufficient information from the various post-mortems from different bros' relationships and experiences, we can produce a lesson summary for the benefit of the other bros. Who knows, we might even be able to publish a book and make some $$$ out of it. Hahaha.

colins

17-10-2008, 03:23 PM

.....Lets meet up for teh tarik again after my current girlfriend leaves and we can conduct a post-mortem. Maybe by collecting sufficient information from the various post-mortems from different bros' relationships and experiences, we can produce a lesson summary for the benefit of the other bros. Who knows, we might even be able to publish a book and make some $$$ out of it. Hahaha.

Hahaha...ok, but as soon as she leaves you will know exactly what's happening to you. Not many things to post mortem, perhaps kopi itself will be more eventful. haha... lets arrange la.

slider_72

17-10-2008, 05:13 PM

Hahaha...ok, but as soon as she leaves you will know exactly what's happening to you. Not many things to post mortem, perhaps kopi itself will be more eventful. haha... lets arrange la.

Ever so true.

Actually for our next kopi session, I think I would be more interested to find out more about your long distance mind-fucking techniques. Sounds damn cool. :cool:

colins

17-10-2008, 05:34 PM

Ever so true.

Actually for our next kopi session, I think I would be more interested to find out more about your long distance mind-fucking techniques. Sounds damn cool. :cool:

How did you know about that? I am just following everything exactly as my mentor says, and a good scolding when I falter from time to time. But then it wasn't what I really set out to achieve, kinda forced to do it but the lesson is seared in me now.

But seriously, I rather have a couple of cybersex anytime, esp to girls who appear to be angelic and innocent.

Sorry, out of topic! :p

aces68

18-10-2008, 10:31 PM

glooper83

19-10-2008, 01:48 AM

Its not a price for gaining good karma in return... Hope that you'll be blessed bro Collins. Sorry for not keeping in touch recently.. Was working and training but thats over now. Now fairly happily attached again so quite busy also even thou i may be online on msn. Really sorry abt tht.. Take care Bros out there.. ;)

Wooden_Handle

19-10-2008, 02:04 AM

Bro colins, remember any caregiver will need help from time to time, esp when you are involved. I think its depend on your amount of emotional attachment, but its a 2 edge sword, once attached its also may cause certain level of upset and if you not attached the other party will feel that you not sincere.

How did you know about that? I am just following everything exactly as my mentor says, and a good scolding when I falter from time to time. But then it wasn't what I really set out to achieve, kinda forced to do it but the lesson is seared in me now.

FL Lover

19-10-2008, 02:16 AM

DO_YOU_BJ

19-10-2008, 04:09 AM

I have been through that.... sad but no choice, inexperienced cheongster at that time.:D

What applies to you may not apply to others bro.
We always heard of an old saying...like based on your theory....
Head bang wall liao pain sure learn!
But some, bang liao, head pain, bleed, skull crack still a dumb ass.....think bro A is in this category dude.

FL Lover

20-10-2008, 12:18 AM

What applies to you may not apply to others bro.
We always heard of an old saying...like based on your theory....
Head bang wall liao pain sure learn!
But some, bang liao, head pain, bleed, skull crack still a dumb ass.....think bro A is in this category dude.

hahahah... then soft approach and hard approach also no use. Anyway as friends of TS, they all have done their parts. The rest is up to bro A to think straight.

In fact, most of the times we all cannot see clearly once ganna KC. Only time will heal him.

colins

20-10-2008, 04:55 AM

bro colins,

you deserve praise for your effort to try to help bro A, but you can only help those who want to help themselves. I know it sounds corny but it's actually very true. As long as you tried your best and your conscience is clear, that's all you can ask of yourself.

Thanks. I think any bro who comes in with a heart to help relieve someone else's pain deserves the same praise. Thats including yourself in a lot of time. Maybe the definition of "tried the best" and "clear conscience" is subjective to the helper himself, and this is what I like to bring a balance to, in this thread.

Its not a price for gaining good karma in return... Hope that you'll be blessed bro Collins. Sorry for not keeping in touch recently.. Was working and training but thats over now. Now fairly happily attached again so quite busy also even thou i may be online on msn. Really sorry abt tht.. Take care Bros out there.. ;)

You've got to be a little careful with the word "sorry" in this melocholy thread, friend, cos it may unfortunately bring you under the suspicion of being Bro A in the story. haha...juz kidding

Bro colins, remember any caregiver will need help from time to time, esp when you are involved. I think its depend on your amount of emotional attachment, but its a 2 edge sword, once attached its also may cause certain level of upset and if you not attached the other party will feel that you not sincere.

You are right, thats why I think balance is important. Firstly, we do everything for a reason, so sincerity has to be there to follow thru. Second, emotional attachment arise from expectations, so once you achieve the state of no expectations, you can't be hurt.

colins

20-10-2008, 05:05 AM

True and agreed. This is the soft approach of helping someone to step out with supports from friends.

I got another approach... THE HARD WAY OUT. Let him get cheated, dumped by WL. Then he will wake up and realise how silly he is. He might for a period of time drown himself in sorrows, self-pity. He will forget eventually as time passed.

I can tell you. If a guy who had been through all these, his heart and mind will mature. There is always a saying... Spare the ROD, spolit the child.

I have been through that.... sad but no choice, inexperienced cheongster at that time.:D

Well, if we apply the 'hard way out' approach, we might as well not help. haha... Seriously if you have been thru hard way out approach youself and later see the same shit happening to people ard you, sooner or later, you will at least say something for the victim's benefit.

I think its the approach in helping that matters. For example, telling the person that he is stupid and hopes he changes becos of your judgement is similar to doing nothing. In that, you might as well keep quiet. We should try to affect the person's thought process rather than the person's action, becos everything the victim does, in most cases, is not made with a conscious mind but rather to fulfil a need he may not be aware of.

gertt234

21-10-2008, 12:20 AM

Hi Bro's,

As a person new to cheonging, I read SBF to gain knowledge on the ways of WL's (or FL's, etc) so that hopefully when the time comes that I get KC'ed, I will be able to recognize it and get out of it with minimal damage in any way.

I don't think majority (I shall refrain from using anyone) can avoid being KC'ed without being on the receiving end at least once.

My 2 cents.

Thanks to all bro's contributing (positively/negatively) to the forums and sharing experiences.

Kudo's (hope I got the word right) to all bro's helping other bro's to snap out of it.

FL Lover

21-10-2008, 01:45 AM

Well, if we apply the 'hard way out' approach, we might as well not help. haha... Seriously if you have been thru hard way out approach youself and later see the same shit happening to people ard you, sooner or later, you will at least say something for the victim's benefit.

I think its the approach in helping that matters. For example, telling the person that he is stupid and hopes he changes becos of your judgement is similar to doing nothing. In that, you might as well keep quiet. We should try to affect the person's thought process rather than the person's action, becos everything the victim does, in most cases, is not made with a conscious mind but rather to fulfil a need he may not be aware of.

Bro FYI. f you need to help someone in trouble esp getting into this kind of KC thing... you have to see if the person is worth the help. There are two type of persons. First type will be grateful to you for helping him and Second type is cursing you for being Kapo and get into the same shit again

Not all are worth helping... Whether you like my idea or not. Hahaha... To me, if a person does not want to be helped, then better leave him alone. You can have your opinion but that does not mean my way of doing is wrong.

Anyway you might think you are doing a good deed by helping that person but if he in the process does not learn from the experiece... Are you going to help him again for the second time or perharps third time? I wonder....:D
You might be doing harm to that person for helping him instead of letting him learnt.

Anyway thats my view on this point. But its good to know that there are helpful pple arnd...:p

colins

21-10-2008, 03:50 AM

Bro FYI. f you need to help someone in trouble esp getting into this kind of KC thing... you have to see if the person is worth the help. There are two type of persons. First type will be grateful to you for helping him and Second type is cursing you for being Kapo and get into the same shit again

Not all are worth helping... Whether you like my idea or not. Hahaha... To me, if a person does not want to be helped, then better leave him alone. You can have your opinion but that does not mean my way of doing is wrong.

Anyway you might think you are doing a good deed by helping that person but if he in the process does not learn from the experiece... Are you going to help him again for the second time or perharps third time? I wonder....:D
You might be doing harm to that person for helping him instead of letting him learnt.

Anyway thats my view on this point. But its good to know that there are helpful pple arnd...:p

Your idea or my idea, seriously it doesn't matter. The source of those ideas is the same.

Our pretext is when somebody stretches a hand out for help, you can't apply the Hard Way Out approach without concerning yourself with the nature of that person's problem. That is my point. You dun always use the same hammer to deal with all type of metals. Hard Way Out is a heavy hammer and undeniably can be applied to those hardcore super mindfucked victims. Those deserve to die and be reborn. However, most of the bros here are seeking for specific answers to deal with their specific problems, they are on the verge of making silly decisions. For them you have to apply the pull becos they do not need to go all the way to die and be reborn.

Yes, helping someone will cause them to rely on you. In a way, you have to influence their thought process rather to teach them on what to do. There must be a certain analysis for that to happen cos you need to discover their innermost issues. I believe everything happens for a reason, and there must reasons for their fall and even the tendency to rely. Usually the help happens within, solve the source, you solve the behaviour problems.

DO_YOU_BJ

21-10-2008, 04:15 AM

Usually the help happens within, solve the source, you solve the behaviour problems.

Spot on.
The prob of KC actually root is the individual.
It's usually those who belong to the 没自信category.
Lots have to do with their perception of life.
Straighten this and you'll fix more of what the person came into this place for help was initially.
Well said bro obiwan:D

FL Lover

21-10-2008, 09:32 AM

Your idea or my idea, seriously it doesn't matter. The source of those ideas is the same.

Usually the help happens within, solve the source, you solve the behaviour problems.

A different insight on what you have said. Anyway hope that your method works on Bro A....

Who knows I might need yor help in future to pull me up......:p hehehehe...

Monkey4

21-10-2008, 10:59 AM

I'll help but there's a limit.
If i sense insincerity from the other party, i'll walk away & buy the popcorn to see the end.

Bro Colins & XYZ, you have stretched out your hand, but in the event it causes your hands to be amputated, FUCK IT! Let the mutha fuka burn.......

Like i said in a post, some were born to screw, some were born to be screwed.
They've chosen their path so be it. You have initiated to help, thus even wif this intention you'll receive merits for this life...dun worry.....
After all, at the end of the day, if they peril at their own hand, it wont affect you the slightest bit rite.......you'll still sleep peacefully at nite! I know i will:D

Bro Collins,

However, I hope you can understand that reciprocation is never part of the package in helping someone, or even to the extend, loving someone.
As long as your heart tells you it is the right thing to do, then do it without expecting anything. It will make you feel better.

From what I have read, you have done your part fully, and it is what matters. In life we cannot expect another person to response accordingly to our due effort. If right now you dun feel you owe anyone anything, you are good. :)

Bro colins, you deserved the recognition in helping the poorer one, but sometimes they may not noticed their own state, and they are still living in their dream world. Please keep trying and never give up, cos I think 1 day he will be in even worst mess emotionally.

Its not a price for gaining good karma in return... Hope that you'll be blessed bro Collins.

Bro Colins, I agreed with all the above being said by the bros here... but would like to add that even if bro A were to continue ignoring u or doesnt want to continue accepting your help or listening to your opinion, if I were u, I will still be around like his shadow there waiting to assist him when he falters.... cos being a true friend means always around to lend a listening ear but do not judge (when a person is still living in a dream.... whatever things he hears which may be detrimental to his present state of mind... he will choose to ignore it)...

Kudos to u bro colins and sorry for this late posting cos me oso MIA for some time due to my recent loss of one of my best friends. :(

colins

21-10-2008, 08:00 PM

A different insight on what you have said. Anyway hope that your method works on Bro A....

Who knows I might need yor help in future to pull me up......:p hehehehe...

It din work on Bro A although I tried my best, for him, maybe no method would work. His problem is not KC, but with self confidence.

Always be ready help another if you do have problems man. Cheers

colins

21-10-2008, 08:27 PM

Bro Colins, I agreed with all the above being said by the bros here... but would like to add that even if bro A were to continue ignoring u or doesnt want to continue accepting your help or listening to your opinion, if I were u, I will still be around like his shadow there waiting to assist him when he falters.... cos being a true friend means always around to lend a listening ear but do not judge (when a person is still living in a dream.... whatever things he hears which may be detrimental to his present state of mind... he will choose to ignore it)...

Kudos to u bro colins and sorry for this late posting cos me oso MIA for some time due to my recent loss of one of my best friends. :(

Thanks, sometimes I will give such a hard push to some bros that my words will chase them away. It is to attack where they hurt most, the pride. The reason which I do that is to make them feel pain enough for them to see the truth around them. With clarity of mind, pride is called confidence. Without any clarity of mind, pride is an escape from reality.

Yes I know they are affected and if they still need my presence they will come back. If they dun come back, well, they dun need any help anymore. This is how I approach the problem of me ever to over stretch myself again. Cos I know I wouldn't be able to reject anybody who stretches his hand out anytime.

shanshen

27-10-2008, 10:30 PM

bro collins

what is the actual issues that bro A faced? if he is really serious with his girl who went back and yean for her return..it takes time to heal the wound.
if the girl do comes back and stick with him.he will be a happy man again..
looks like he has given his heart and soul to his gf...

by introducing another girl to him may not really solve the issues..it only temporirly fil the void he is into now especially if he is in contant contact with his girl and knowing that she will comng back soon..

so I feel, its best to let him be himself and unless his girl did not come back to look for him, than it will be a different story..

as i dont know the actual situation...my take is if his girl is coming back...than let him be and wait for her return...
loving a person is a strange thing and nothing u say will going to change anything...

you will be rewarded for helping a bro though in a different way...good karma will follow you...god bless...

colins

27-10-2008, 11:31 PM

what is the actual issues that bro A faced? if he is really serious with his girl who went back and yean for her return..it takes time to heal the wound.
if the girl do comes back and stick with him.he will be a happy man again..
looks like he has given his heart and soul to his gf...

by introducing another girl to him may not really solve the issues..it only temporirly fil the void he is into now especially if he is in contant contact with his girl and knowing that she will comng back soon..

so I feel, its best to let him be himself and unless his girl did not come back to look for him, than it will be a different story..

as i dont know the actual situation...my take is if his girl is coming back...than let him be and wait for her return...
loving a person is a strange thing and nothing u say will going to change anything...

Thank you. For Bro A's case, and unfortunately in many bros' case, they are willing to offer heart and soul AND MONEY. However for his girl, it is apparent that she wants only MONEY in exchange of her heart and soul. Now we all know that if you use money to exchange for someone's 'heart & soul', it will only last as long as the money last. Since anyone else can provide the universal currency to exchange for her heart and soul, Bro A's offer of his own heart and soul is misplaced as to her, these are NOTHING.

So if Bro A still believes in giving up his most precious heart and soul which means nothing to her, he is deluding himself that both of these is worth something to her. He might as well go to the Escape Theme Park and lives his dream state forever. Delusion is an escape from reality. Reality is he is not confident in himself for who he think he is. Therefore the need to escape to feel considerably better.

To answer your question directly, yes he will be a happy man for a short while as long as he has the cash, but when she leaves again he will be both unhappy and broken. Not to mention the amount of money spent. In the worst case scenario, if he is 'successful' in marrying her (assuming she got enough confident in his Gold Mountain), he will be forever be in the clutch of this particular girl. All in all, such happiness can only be found in a dream, and we are men, we will wake up one day. Unfortunately, that will be when all those words make sense, he will be saying sorry to himself endlessly but too late.

Wooden_Handle

28-10-2008, 12:10 AM

Who is bro obiwan??

I think those belong to 没自信category will need a lot of TLC to get them stand on their own feet.

However, we are lucky to have Auntie DYBJ and Auntie colins, even Auntie sammyboyforum also joining the Auntie Agony threads.

Spot on.
The prob of KC actually root is the individual.
It's usually those who belong to the 没自信category.
Lots have to do with their perception of life.
Straighten this and you'll fix more of what the person came into this place for help was initially.
Well said bro obiwan:D

Wooden_Handle

28-10-2008, 12:24 AM

I agreed wholeheartedly with bro Monkey, if we know the guy will fall, have to try to assist in anyway, even though he is resisting the help. Some how and in some way we will be able to get his attention, no matter how high his resistance there will be low moments and he need a fren to talk to.

I had experienced as volunteer before in big 'S' group in UK and persistence seldom failed.

Bro Colins, I agreed with all the above being said by the bros here... but would like to add that even if bro A were to continue ignoring u or doesnt want to continue accepting your help or listening to your opinion, if I were u, I will still be around like his shadow there waiting to assist him when he falters.... cos being a true friend means always around to lend a listening ear but do not judge (when a person is still living in a dream.... whatever things he hears which may be detrimental to his present state of mind... he will choose to ignore it)...

colins

28-10-2008, 05:57 AM

Who is bro obiwan??

I think those belong to 没自信category will need a lot of TLC to get them stand on their own feet.

However, we are lucky to have Auntie DYBJ and Auntie colins, even Auntie sammyboyforum also joining the Auntie Agony threads.

obiwan is a nick which hasn't been created yet but so far it means me. I seriously hope that the auntie stays within this thread, haha...

If you give too much TLC to people in that category, it will cause a lot of reliance on you, inevitably causing them to constantly need your help to stand. Plus also the fact that you may encourage them to avoid confronting the real issue of the problem by going 'soft'. In summary, built their confidence for them by telling them to work for it. Usually people only need some techniques in thinking and a little push off the edge to take their first step.

Wooden_Handle

29-10-2008, 12:51 AM

I think there are timing involved as well: push too early he may jump off the cliff to back to his own shelf and push too late he will be lazy to walk liao..:)

shanshen

29-10-2008, 01:27 PM

Thank you. For Bro A's case, and unfortunately in many bros' case, they are willing to offer heart and soul AND MONEY. However for his girl, it is apparent that she wants only MONEY in exchange of her heart and soul. Now we all know that if you use money to exchange for someone's 'heart & soul', it will only last as long as the money last. Since anyone else can provide the universal currency to exchange for her heart and soul, Bro A's offer of his own heart and soul is misplaced as to her, these are NOTHING.

So if Bro A still believes in giving up his most precious heart and soul which means nothing to her, he is deluding himself that both of these is worth something to her. He might as well go to the Escape Theme Park and lives his dream state forever. Delusion is an escape from reality. Reality is he is not confident in himself for who he think he is. Therefore the need to escape to feel considerably better.

To answer your question directly, yes he will be a happy man for a short while as long as he has the cash, but when she leaves again he will be both unhappy and broken. Not to mention the amount of money spent. In the worst case scenario, if he is 'successful' in marrying her (assuming she got enough confident in his Gold Mountain), he will be forever be in the clutch of this particular girl. All in all, such happiness can only be found in a dream, and we are men, we will wake up one day. Unfortunately, that will be when all those words make sense, he will be saying sorry to himself endlessly but too late.

in that case, bro A is still in his "love dream" mode and being in that state of mind, is best to let time do the talking..until he sees that the light at the end of the tunnel is dimming and getting dimmer, will then he "wake" up for this stupor state of mind...ofcourse by then, he may have hurt his wallet but its a price to pay if you want to chiong and fall into the KC trap...but most important is, bro A can recover and learn from it..

colins

30-10-2008, 02:32 AM

in that case, bro A is still in his "love dream" mode and being in that state of mind, is best to let time do the talking..until he sees that the light at the end of the tunnel is dimming and getting dimmer, will then he "wake" up for this stupor state of mind...ofcourse by then, he may have hurt his wallet but its a price to pay if you want to chiong and fall into the KC trap...but most important is, bro A can recover and learn from it..

Sometimes, people stay in the dream state for the rest of their lives. It becomes their destiny. Its quite scary to be able to see the rest of their lives and no effort can be done to change it.

RAINBOW seasons

30-10-2008, 05:06 PM

Sometimes, people stay in the dream state for the rest of their lives. It becomes their destiny. Its quite scary to be able to see the rest of their lives and no effort can be done to change it.

They will forever remain in a world of hallucination unless they choose to wake up of this fantasy-a world that never meant to exist for them.

HairyBottom

01-11-2008, 12:43 AM

Another version for your consideration:

A clear mind is a HORNY mind

A mess-up mind is a KC-ed mind

The above applicable in SBF context lah:rolleyes:

Hiaz....life is always filled with uncertainty, how nice if we can always see whats ahead and plan or be ready for it.

thats a good one! short but clear to the point illustration.

maybe can also say a clear mind is like a window, images come and go and a mess-up mind is like a camera where pictures come but just wont go.

i would say it's still best to follow the triple F rule - Find Fark Forget.

colins

01-11-2008, 05:30 AM

i would say it's still best to follow the triple F rule - Find Fark Forget.

I've heard some bros who say that they feel the sense of emptiness after they finish a session. In them, the triple F rule dun apply anymore. In fact, bros who prefer certain type of girls, whether its looks or figure, are looking for more than just the 3Fs.

HairyBottom

01-11-2008, 09:08 AM

I've heard some bros who say that they feel the sense of emptiness after they finish a session. In them, the triple F rule dun apply anymore. In fact, bros who prefer certain type of girls, whether its looks or figure, are looking for more than just the 3Fs.

these will fall under the category of companionship liao.

quoting a paragraph in mandarin i saw on the net, which i feel it very much describe the needs of companionship in man.

通常情况下，老婆是倾诉者，而红颜知己则是聆听者。她也许是温柔的可人儿，也可能像豪爽的哥们儿，在她面前男人可以是倦鸟是浪子，可以疲惫、孤独、无助、逃避、怠惰，而她是能接纳你的黑夜，给你安静，做你恢复能量的空间。
如果说老婆是太阳，情人是月亮，那么红颜知己则是星星。太阳月亮有疲倦的时候，星星却没有，它闪闪烁烁若即若离，甘于寂寞却又灿烂而长久。

HairyBottom

01-11-2008, 09:56 AM

This paragraph is good, pretty much explains the KC factor.

情人比老婆好是有原因的，审美疲劳和爱情疲劳使男人感觉情人比老婆好。一般情人都是年轻漂亮的，即便是年龄相仿的也是比较会安抚伺候自己的女人。有时候情人不仅是性的关系，也真有感情的原因。没有感情在一起的情人，那就是一种交易的存在。钱买性，买心理的一种知足感和快感。

　　男人天生就花心，对异性有着强烈的占有欲望。男人天生就是要征服女人的，当然不是靠暴力，而已引诱和收买。
　　
男人对自己整日朝夕相伴的老婆时间长了有一种麻木，没有新鲜的感觉，爱情疲劳，审美疲劳，有时候不仅是审美疲劳，还感觉老婆恶心，总是婆婆妈妈的，整日里啰嗦起来没完没了。再热情的爱情也有降温的时候，在激荡的情感也有平静的时候。那些所谓的事业成功的成功人士们，外面一帮和苍蝇一样的小女人等着不劳而获呢。有的小女人专门找大男人，一是认为大男人成熟，一是好勾引，一是钱厚有积累。小女人总是可人的，给人一种怜惜的神态，实际骨子里是吃定你的。想做别人情人的女人，目的不外乎是真爱或崇拜或有目的。真爱的少。

情人之所以吸引男人，有自己的一套女人方法。对他的理解和对她妻子的宽容都让男人有一种错觉，那就是此女比较大气，有宽宏和善良的心。实际上，任何一个女人在真爱面前都容不下另外一个女人的存在。情人的所谓的宽容实际就是一种策略，一种攻略，甚至是谋略。在这背后隐藏着伤感的心。

　　情人不总见面，也不是整日在一起过日子，所以情人一切的优点都展示出来，缺点都带回家，都在背后。老婆不一样白天晚上都在一起生活，很多的隐私几乎就是对丈夫公开的，包括身体的每个细微的地方，丈夫都知道，都是看够的。

longwinter

02-11-2008, 08:13 AM

I've heard some bros who say that they feel the sense of emptiness after they finish a session. In them, the triple F rule dun apply anymore. In fact, bros who prefer certain type of girls, whether its looks or figure, are looking for more than just the 3Fs.

yea, agreed. Initially, when l step into commerical sex, the main purpose is to have fun, enjoy myself, satisfy my lust. l went all over to find nice good places with good services to cheong. l guess this is the intention of most bros when they just step into the commerical sex world rite?

but dont know why, as time passes, l find that l am not jus looking for jus a fark, l tink l harbour something more than this. l will tend to rtf and just look for the same gal if we can click and have the chemistry.

For me, my mindset had been changed to, l just like to find a gal that l can click, and can have those kind of chemistry with. It is no longer the kind of fark and go. Anyway after the gal which l am fond of, left. My cheonging habit totally died down.

longwinter

02-11-2008, 08:20 AM

Anyway guys, pardon me for the above naive and childish feelings l display. :(

jojogigi

02-11-2008, 10:41 AM

Anyway guys, pardon me for the above naive and childish feelings l display. :(

dude.. its not naive. i'm also one. and infact alot of us chiongsters are like this. They want the gfe feeling. something we had lost long long time ago and we use money to buy it.

longwinter

02-11-2008, 11:01 AM

dude.. its not naive. i'm also one. and infact alot of us chiongsters are like this. They want the gfe feeling. something we had lost long long time ago and we use money to buy it.

haha, thanks for the console, bro. Even though, l do noe that the gfe and happiness is just short term, but sumhow in the heart, l still yearn for it. Maybe like wanting to have a short sweet memory to fill my heart and memory bah.

l think in every guy, there will always be gals they are fond of and can click well, and they will just wanted to do those sweet nice things for her without any obligations. Cos when u see her happy, u also will feel happy and good as well. opps, tink l getting out of pt at here liaos. :D

porscheclub

02-11-2008, 01:43 PM

porscheclub

02-11-2008, 01:56 PM

I've heard some bros who say that they feel the sense of emptiness after they finish a session. In them, the triple F rule dun apply anymore. In fact, bros who prefer certain type of girls, whether its looks or figure, are looking for more than just the 3Fs.

I'm guilty :p but I'm sure many others are as well.

I tried calling a few up chicks but cancelled the appts after a while & even just sat & chit chat with one but still paid her. I'm beginning to wonder if I need sex anymore :eek:

The worst would be when u mix feelings into a commercial fuck. Either party gets involved & it hurts real bad. Percentage of a successful relationship in paid sex is very thin. I would do the 3xF & not get serious but when u're not serious, it gets dry & empty. If u get serious, u start to wonder if she's true.... aiya damn messy better don't go there.

jojogigi

02-11-2008, 02:46 PM

If u get serious, u start to wonder if she's true.... aiya damn messy better don't go there.

hahaha this is so spot on.. you start to get suspicious... jealous... standard sop leh. hahahaha because when you start to feel and treat her like gf instead of a WL. I also got kenna this... learnt it as a lesson and now dun really treat seriously cos its never really serious unless its serious. Anyway i basically just play on with the gf/bf game but not to get involved seriously in the process. (it like playing russian roulette. one day might just get shot) Lets say a little process to fill my void momentarily. But definitely not for the long run.

Imagine 2 yrs ago i book a Lor 8 WL for 2 hrs to go eat and never fuck!!??? pple think im crazy. Lucky still got investments returns. Sometimes fuck for free. still a friend though. that time still young bird. learn to fly but end up falling down the nest.

HairyBottom

02-11-2008, 02:59 PM

I tried calling a few up chicks but cancelled the appts after a while & even just sat & chit chat with one but still paid her. I'm beginning to wonder if I need sex anymore :eek:

not surprising. life here is fast paced and all abt wrk and $. communication getting harder and harder. not only small head needs release big head also needs release stress sometimes.

jojogigi

02-11-2008, 03:01 PM

l think in every guy, there will always be gals they are fond of and can click well, and they will just wanted to do those sweet nice things for her without any obligations. Cos when u see her happy, u also will feel happy and good as well.

actually this part of you. which you just said. Is very dangerous. Cause if you really meet a WL who is out for your money. thats it. Cos if she can act and fit in that category.... jialat liao.

although i have girls that im fond of and click well. I've learnt not to do any sweet things to her unless they really deserves it. (i did so many sweet things for sg girls in past..and its really fucking sweet one no joke) end up. also useless. sometimes girls are just sluts. they like to be abused... they like to feel a challenge. bad boys.
They like you they like you. Its not what you do. If its what you do. then they like what you do. not you.
anyway finding love in these type of circles is like running a track. going in circles and circles. Either we finish the race or we give up halfway.
lose one girl. find another one. lose again find another one again. neverending story.
我们不够她们狠。

HairyBottom

02-11-2008, 03:13 PM

although i have girls that im fond of and click well. I've learnt not to do any sweet things to her unless they really deserves it. (i did so many sweet things for sg girls in past..and its really fucking sweet one no joke) end up. also useless. sometimes girls are just sluts. they like to be abused... they like to feel a challenge. bad boys.
They like you they like you. Its not what you do. If its what you do. then they like what you do. not you.

think it depends...dont 4get sg girls generally have high expectations of guys...short of anything sweet to her the girl will run away even if she likes u initially cos they will compare u with their other friends bfs. seen too many such cases liao....

jojogigi

02-11-2008, 03:18 PM

think it depends...dont 4get sg girls generally have high expectations of guys...short of anything sweet to her the girl will run away even if she likes u initially cos they will compare u with their other friends bfs. seen too many such cases liao....

maybe different cases ah. when i don't give a fuck. than they are more loving. when i give a damn.. they don't give a fuck. sigh. Its understandable why so many sg guys are turning to prc MMs. im one of them. LOL and sigh.
Sg guys are sick of complication. make it simple. use money and buy. sad but a fact.

colins

02-11-2008, 03:31 PM

yea, agreed. Initially, when l step into commerical sex, the main purpose is to have fun, enjoy myself, satisfy my lust. l went all over to find nice good places with good services to cheong. l guess this is the intention of most bros when they just step into the commerical sex world rite?

but dont know why, as time passes, l find that l am not jus looking for jus a fark, l tink l harbour something more than this. l will tend to rtf and just look for the same gal if we can click and have the chemistry.

For me, my mindset had been changed to, l just like to find a gal that l can click, and can have those kind of chemistry with. It is no longer the kind of fark and go. Anyway after the gal which l am fond of, left. My cheonging habit totally died down.

Anyway guys, pardon me for the above naive and childish feelings l display. :(

haha, thanks for the console, bro. Even though, l do noe that the gfe and happiness is just short term, but sumhow in the heart, l still yearn for it. Maybe like wanting to have a short sweet memory to fill my heart and memory bah.

l think in every guy, there will always be gals they are fond of and can click well, and they will just wanted to do those sweet nice things for her without any obligations. Cos when u see her happy, u also will feel happy and good as well. opps, tink l getting out of pt at here liaos. :D

No bro, you are not getting out of point here, in fact I think you are spot on. The forum is full of bros of different age and different stage of life. When you are young, your thinking is still new and the flesh is still fresh. At your prime, this is instinctive. When we start to see life clearer, there are many things which we see that conflicts with our thinking, and thereafter we start to seek more than sex, we are seeking a comfort zone from our life. In short, we wanted to go back to what it once was when we were young, but minus the need to fulfil the body, so wah-lah we want more from the same piece of flesh which we can buy. We now want emotional fulfilment.

Of cos, this is the first step towards a KC trap. Girls who identify your needs can easily put you on an emotional entrapment becos they know that you NEED it. We rely on our emotional fulfilment more and more when we get into our adult life. These girls, after giving it to you, also make you rely on them. So in order to keep the love coming, a lot of us chose the easy way, just pay for it. Like heroine, we become addicted until we start to delude ourselves that it is what we live for. Then thats it, every dollar equals your ability to acquire love per minute. Life itself, becomes one big cycle of pain and relief, pain and relief.

longwinter

02-11-2008, 04:16 PM

Of cos, this is the first step towards a KC trap. Girls who identify your needs can easily put you on an emotional entrapment becos they know that you NEED it. We rely on our emotional fulfilment more and more when we get into our adult life. These girls, after giving it to you, also make you rely on them. So in order to keep the love coming, a lot of us chose the easy way, just pay for it. Like heroine, we become addicted until we start to delude ourselves that it is what we live for. Then thats it, every dollar equals your ability to acquire love per minute. Life itself, becomes one big cycle of pain and relief, pain and relief.

yea, l agreed too. l find myself in a dangerous position also. But for me, l do instill this mindset in me that if the gal reacts strangely or show to me that she is more towards the $$$$ side, l will just back off. But such things are hard to say also, nothing is 100% guranteed also. Who noes l might meet a gal whose conning skills is just so up to the standard that l couldnt feel or spotted it.

After she left, the mood of going to play around machiam like totally dies down. Did cheong a bit, but not as much as l used to. l also quite surprised myself, even my close friend around me ask me y l never go cheong liao. Why no mood to play?? l think l noe the answer very well for myself, l guess ultimately l still never forget her, and still miss her. Sometime l will jus dial her singapore hp no to see if she is back. From wad l am doing, l do noe l yearn for her return. So far not yet. If she is back, l am sure to go back and see her.

But Best is that l hope she dont come back for good bah. :(

DO_YOU_BJ

02-11-2008, 05:03 PM

Like as always, everyone has their reasons for going for a commercial bonk.
The old saying of bonk and go...is it really applicable?
To me....NO!
Why do people actually RTF?
Becos of something that happened there in the room that's not commercial that left a mark on the individual that he knew, only RTF can he realise or feel the same again.
This is the entree of KC.
Once this thing gets stronger, he's as good as KCed already, its to wat extent only.
If a man in a dark period of his life, he will embrace this feeling like the light shining into darkness.......
And once he THINKS he got this lite, he'll whatever he can to embrace it and not let go.....NO MATTER WAT!
This is a cycle that never ends.
Why do people spend to get burnt? A common thing people joke about others over kopi.....well......who wants to get burnt in the 1st place???????
Sad but true, the more you cheong, the more the chances u will FEEL for someone.......even me....i have met many that i felt for, but i made it a pure motto of mine, that i will KC and not get KCed......difficult..YES VERY but i always remind myself, it aint real...it aint real else i think i wud have died many times over.
The more i spend, the more i'll have no attachments to the gals...that's why i choose singers.......cos its like feeding animals in the zoo, throwing meat into their cage...........humans they still are, but honestly, i dun look at them that way, thus my own protection barrier.
But when someone comes along and dun wan money, i'll definately turn my alarms on....cos it has happened so many times...sigh........then my predator instincts will set it...cos the setting is right for KC traps to happen liao.
Many go into this sleeping. Pls open your eyes when you embark on this.
Remember why you went there to seek this release....else you wont be released but actually getting more screwed that previously.

DO_YOU_BJ

02-11-2008, 05:05 PM

Sometime l will jus dial her singapore hp no to see if she is back. From wad l am doing, l do noe l yearn for her return. So far not yet. If she is back, l am sure to go back and see her.

But Best is that l hope she dont come back for good bah. :(

Oh she'll be back dun worry.
Here's your situation.
You're standing at the edge of a well waiting for her cue to jump.
Am glad you know it yourself too, would be nice to know how you will manage to climb out from it once she commands you to "JUMP!"

Wooden_Handle

03-11-2008, 12:32 AM

Bro LW ltnc...:)

I think and from my own experience, I believed it is matter of time that you will be on your feet and cheong again. AND of cos this time will be cheonging more wisely and to be serve instead of to serve.

After she left, the mood of going to play around machiam like totally dies down. Did cheong a bit, but not as much as l used to. l also quite surprised myself, even my close friend around me ask me y l never go cheong liao. Why no mood to play?? l think l noe the answer very well for myself, l guess ultimately l still never forget her, and still miss her. Sometime l will jus dial her singapore hp no to see if she is back. From wad l am doing, l do noe l yearn for her return. So far not yet. If she is back, l am sure to go back and see her.

(

colins

03-11-2008, 12:50 AM

After she left, the mood of going to play around machiam like totally dies down. Did cheong a bit, but not as much as l used to. l also quite surprised myself, even my close friend around me ask me y l never go cheong liao. Why no mood to play?? l think l noe the answer very well for myself, l guess ultimately l still never forget her, and still miss her. Sometime l will jus dial her singapore hp no to see if she is back. From wad l am doing, l do noe l yearn for her return. So far not yet. If she is back, l am sure to go back and see her.

But Best is that l hope she dont come back for good bah. :(

上的山多终遇虎...bro longwinter your situation also quite worrying, hope you haven't really spent too much. Well hope you can live thru it if she comes back.

ekemono

03-11-2008, 01:40 AM

Sometime l will jus dial her singapore hp no to see if she is back. From wad l am doing, l do noe l yearn for her return. So far not yet. If she is back, l am sure to go back and see her.:(

I did that before too. Tried a few times dialling her SG nos. then one fine day she called me from China. I was at JC having a good time and her call took me by surprise. One would have assume the joyful and chatty conversation but actually, I dun have anything to talk to her. So it was lip service for the next few mins. Hmmmm, maybe she is looking for someone to sponser her trip here. Never called me since and I also didn't note down her China number.

Fatjumbo

03-11-2008, 03:37 AM

DTCEPL

03-11-2008, 09:17 AM

Sorry bro can someone pls kindly explain what's KC means ??

KC = Kum Cheng, in hockien

KC = Gan Qing, in mandarin

and NOT KAR CHNG:D

Meaning kena entrapped in a Man-Woman relationship

Fatjumbo

03-11-2008, 10:05 AM

KC = Kum Cheng, in hockien

KC = Gan Qing, in mandarin

and NOT KAR CHNG:D

Meaning kena entrapped in a Man-Woman relationship

Thanks bro, for the kind explanation.

Indeed this KC trap is real and powerful...majiam kanna Gong Tao like tat. Best I guess is for bros ( including myself ) to go sauna / spa more often to wash away the charm cast by the PRC KTV gals.

Problem here is how to identify, test whether my KTV gal is sincere and for real. Will a WL buy expensive gift for a man rather than hoping the man to buy for her ? For once I am confused !!! unless it's ""Fang Chang Xian Diao Ta Yu"" strategy.

Any advise for season bros here who have seen it all. Thanks :)

warbird

03-11-2008, 12:58 PM

... The forum is full of bros of different age and different stage of life. When you are young, your thinking is still new and the flesh is still fresh. At your prime, this is instinctive. When we start to see life clearer, there are many things which we see that conflicts with our thinking, and thereafter we start to seek more than sex, we are seeking a comfort zone from our life. In short, we wanted to go back to what it once was when we were young, but minus the need to fulfil the body, so wah-lah we want more from the same piece of flesh which we can buy. We now want emotional fulfilment.

Of cos, this is the first step towards a KC trap. Girls who identify your needs can easily put you on an emotional entrapment becos they know that you NEED it. We rely on our emotional fulfilment more and more when we get into our adult life. These girls, after giving it to you, also make you rely on them. So in order to keep the love coming, a lot of us chose the easy way, just pay for it. Like heroine, we become addicted until we start to delude ourselves that it is what we live for. Then thats it, every dollar equals your ability to acquire love per minute. Life itself, becomes one big cycle of pain and relief, pain and relief.

Bro colins,

You hv hit the nail on the head!

Many yrs ago, when I was very young, I could fxxk n forget, no matter how pretty the gals were n how much they tried to KC me. I had my share of locals, M'sian Chi, Thais, HK gals, Taiwanese n Ang Mos, both WLs n non-WLS. After FJs, many of them wanted to go for supper/dinner/sight-seeing/dancing...but I refused to spend one extra minute w/ them. I was a machine, a heartless robot!

After a long hiatus due to family commitments, I reentered the WL scene less than 3 yrs ago n I discovered something strange. In additon to sex which I need less frequently, I now want "emotional fulfilment," as bro colins alluded to. I experienced a very painful rs w/ a PRC 2 yrs ago.

It's an addiction. I crave young pretty pussies which by itself is normal n healthy.:D Unfortunately, I also enjoy playing KC game w/ at least some of them to boost my ego n for emotional fulfilment. So far so good. I know it's a risky game n I can get burnt badly.:(

DO_YOU_BJ

03-11-2008, 02:23 PM

Problem here is how to identify, test whether my KTV gal is sincere and for real. Will a WL buy expensive gift for a man rather than hoping the man to buy for her ? For once I am confused !!! unless it's ""Fang Chang Xian Diao Ta Yu"" strategy.

Any advise for season bros here who have seen it all. Thanks :)

All relationships start the same way my young friend.
Where got someone who really wants to be wif you asks you for ex gifts and money?????

DTCEPL

03-11-2008, 03:42 PM

colins

03-11-2008, 04:37 PM

Dear Bros

I guess when age catches up, we need more emotional support/fulfillment then sex.

I am like that for sure.....I need people to talk to, share time and my experience/work problems with her, maybe even someone to cook a nice meal for me and help to massage me when I am tired after work, well if it comes with sex to balance the needs, thats even better. And I don't want her to judge me which normally Family would.

Actually bro, what you need IS a family, haha...

Only thing is, its hard to say things out becos these people know you so well that they will tell you answers that you need to hear, and sadly not things which you WANT to hear. You are escaping from your own judgement!

Say, from today onwards, you get into a habit of judging yourself. Most likely you will start to change for the better, cos naturally you will do the things you need and get the things you want. Suddenly you do not need anymore comfort zone to escape your own judgement. In fact, you'll like to hear what people say about you as you can assess them if its true and if so, change yourself for the better. If not, tell them straight in the face that they are not judging you correctly, with facts and logic as your ammo.

Just remember lo, we seek emotional comfort becos it is too painful to face the truth. Its like a wound that will never heal unless you confront it once and for all. Emotional comfort only allow us to live day by day, with that little pain at the side constantly draining our mental. All you need is to fucking tear it apart and find that root of the problem, then heal it or eliminate it.

Dun be afraid of judgement, it is what keep us living everyday, not dying everyday.

DO_YOU_BJ

03-11-2008, 05:58 PM

Only thing is, its hard to say things out becos these people know you so well that they will tell you answers that you need to hear, and sadly not things which you WANT to hear. You are escaping from your own judgement!

Say, from today onwards, you get into a habit of judging yourself. Most likely you will start to change for the better, cos naturally you will do the things you need and get the things you want. Suddenly you do not need anymore comfort zone to escape your own judgement. In fact, you'll like to hear what people say about you as you can assess them if its true and if so, change yourself for the better. If not, tell them straight in the face that they are not judging you correctly, with facts and logic as your ammo.

Just remember lo, we seek emotional comfort becos it is too painful to face the truth. Its like a wound that will never heal unless you confront it once and for all. Emotional comfort only allow us to live day by day, with that little pain at the side constantly draining our mental. All you need is to fucking tear it apart and find that root of the problem, then heal it or eliminate it.

Dun be afraid of judgement, it is what keep us living everyday, not dying everyday.

Wow!!!!! Obiwan has spoken....the force is strong on this one!:p

colins

03-11-2008, 06:05 PM

Wow!!!!! Obiwan has spoken....the force is strong on this one!:p

Obiwan is only repeating what Yoda said, he is the source to the force!

DTCEPL

03-11-2008, 06:42 PM

The Grandmaster(S) have all spoken.....may the force with with all of you:D

colins

04-11-2008, 05:14 AM

It's an addiction. I crave young pretty pussies which by itself is normal n healthy.:D Unfortunately, I also enjoy playing KC game w/ at least some of them to boost my ego n for emotional fulfilment. So far so good. I know it's a risky game n I can get burnt badly.:(

Just remember bro, if you want to play the game, you play it to win. If you can't control the outcome, you either fuck off and dun dwell in it. One thing is that ego and emotional fulfilment is a bottomless pit, no matter how much you dump, it will always be empty. Dun tie either one of them to 'victory', otherwise if you fall, all will fall. These girls are masters of giving you false ego and emotions, letting you win can also be part of their ploy. The game never ends until one side stop contacting each other permanently. So winning on Monday can mean that you lose all the way from Tuesday till Sunday. So when you know you've won, you will leave the scene. The world will always remember that Monday, cos you've never lost.

How to freely extract yourself from the scene? Well, you cannot have emotions and you cannot be someone who needs emotional fulfilment from somebody else. Entering the game with emotions to fulfill is just one sure way of putting yourself halfway across the globe behind the starting line. The disadvantage is so strong that you might as well dun play.

DTCEPL

04-11-2008, 11:48 AM

I would advice all Bros not to play with KCs.

It hurt the gal, and it may hurt us too. If we are played by the gal, indirectly we may have allowed such to happen. Just walk away like a gentleman with no regrets, she don't deserved you, and you deserved a better gal - its Karma.

Personally I felt very hurt when she left me, but I got no regrets loving her for 2 years. At least I tried my best to gave her and her family all that I could within my means, if she don't appreciate the love, then its time that I let her go, painful it is but she no longer needs/loves me.

We all have individuals values, that makes everyone an individual, that makes us humans and that makes us different from one another. I can't force the gal to love me the same way as I am willing to gave her.

I sincerely hope all Bros not to play with KCs.....but you can bonk all you wished in commerical sex.

Just a personally tot.....no offence to anyone.

warbird

04-11-2008, 01:26 PM

Just remember bro, if you want to play the game, you play it to win. If you can't control the outcome, you either fuck off and dun dwell in it. One thing is that ego and emotional fulfilment is a bottomless pit, no matter how much you dump, it will always be empty...These girls are masters of giving you false ego and emotions, letting you win can also be part of their ploy. The game never ends until one side stop contacting each other permanently.
How to freely extract yourself from the scene? Well, you cannot have emotions and you cannot be someone who needs emotional fulfilment from somebody else...The disadvantage is so strong that you might as well dun play.

Bro colins,

Very good advice.

Not trying to win lah. If the end game is a draw, I'm satisfied. The gal gets nice payments n I get good companionship. Sure, there will be some sadness even though both of us know it's a business transaction n it wouldn't last forever.:cool:

"I would advice all Bros not to play with KCs.

It hurt the gal, and it may hurt us too. If we are played by the gal, indirectly we may have allowed such to happen. Just walk away like a gentleman with no regrets, she don't deserved you, and you deserved a better gal - its Karma.

Personally I felt very hurt when she left me, but I got no regrets loving her for 2 years.
I sincerely hope all Bros not to play with KCs.....but you can bonk all you wished in commerical sex."

Thx bro DTCEPL,

Not trying to hurt anyone on purpose...although I hv been hurt badly before. My situation is quite complex which I shall not elaborate.

I'll definitely take ur advice seriously.

jojogigi

04-11-2008, 02:01 PM

like what Yang Pei An sang.... 爱上她们是一个错。

shanshen

04-11-2008, 06:02 PM

bro colins has very good pointers for all to follows:

this KC game..guess it occurs to those who has lost the magic touch in their married life or with the fiancee or bride to me or some naive young guys who falls head over toes over some sweet girl with sugar words...

its true what bro longwinter and warbirds experience...after some time..u want someone the spend more quality time to get or experience that special feeling...with...someone who u treasure their compansionship..so the rtf..

however, all have to keep colins and do_u_bj words in mind not to be KCed..

i too rtf a wl few times till she went back and rtf new wl..the services seems better after each rtf and u enjoy the action more...
if she spends time having a meal with you before the rtf ...the entire feeling is different...like u are fucking yr gf or lover...rather than fucking a wl...

so i always like to rft and before the second rtf ..love to buy her a meal to build up the feelings...leading to the bed... ofcourse the rtf must be one u like..

DO_YOU_BJ

04-11-2008, 06:08 PM

so i always like to rft and before the second rtf ..love to buy her a meal to build up the feelings...leading to the bed... ofcourse the rtf must be one u like..

Be mindful of wat you r doin my young friend.
You are setting ur own stage for a KC potential situation.
Soon you will be at the point of no return....u see it...so be very ALERT!

jojogigi

04-11-2008, 06:20 PM

before i rtf the girl i buy durian for her to eat... then the shell can use as vibrator..... hohohohohoh.

shanshen

04-11-2008, 11:12 PM

Be mindful of wat you r doin my young friend.
You are setting ur own stage for a KC potential situation.
Soon you will be at the point of no return....u see it...so be very ALERT!

thank you for the concern, bro...me already know how to play this game and my heart is not easily moved by emotions after having taste it..i know when to pull the brake and when to accelerate..

just playing this game the way i want it to be...like the script had already written and u are directing the play...so u are in total control...

always look out for warnin signs...like what u said...sob stories can be true but asking for fianacial assistance from a customer is entirely different matters...

Randi_Candi

06-11-2008, 05:55 PM

DTCEPL

06-11-2008, 06:15 PM

So my siggy was intended for him. But he is not the only 1 whom falls into such category:p

本来无衣物,何处惹尘埃

colins

07-11-2008, 12:28 PM

本来无一物,何处惹尘埃

How does this apply to bro randi candi's post?

DTCEPL

07-11-2008, 12:53 PM

How does this apply to bro randi candi's post?

He quoted his siggy as reference......then here comes my remarks extracted out from 六祖慧能, quite the same meaning.

colins

07-11-2008, 01:24 PM

He quoted his siggy as reference......then here comes my remarks extracted out from 六祖慧能, quite the same meaning.

I think its quite different bro. 慧能's words show that we shouldn't bring worldly objects into our heart as reality is always subjected to what human can sense and cannot sense.

Whereas bro randi candi's liner is more towards telling his friend, if he can't forget about the poor state which the girls are in, desirable as they can be, he should just avoid the scene and dun worry about being able to NOT think so much after seeing such 'sufferings'.

DTCEPL

07-11-2008, 01:29 PM

I think its quite different bro. 慧能's words show that we shouldn't bring worldly objects into our heart as reality is always subjected to what human can sense and cannot sense.

Whereas bro randi candi's liner is more towards telling his friend, if he can't forget about the poor state which the girls are in, desirable as they can be, he should just avoid the scene and dun worry about being able to NOT think so much after seeing such 'sufferings'.

YES Grandmaster:D for your wisdom.

colins

07-11-2008, 01:39 PM

YES Grandmaster:D for your wisdom.

I think the grandmaster is 慧能. Next is randi candi, hahaha...
I din say those words, only seek to understand and learn from them.;)

longwinter

08-11-2008, 01:19 AM

上的山多终遇虎...bro longwinter your situation also quite worrying, hope you haven't really spent too much. Well hope you can live thru it if she comes back.

Not to worry, bro..l didnt really spent much on her also. She too didnt ask much from me either.

Ya, that is why l hoping she never come back lo.

longwinter

08-11-2008, 01:22 AM

I did that before too. Tried a few times dialling her SG nos. then one fine day she called me from China. I was at JC having a good time and her call took me by surprise. One would have assume the joyful and chatty conversation but actually, I dun have anything to talk to her. So it was lip service for the next few mins. Hmmmm, maybe she is looking for someone to sponser her trip here. Never called me since and I also didn't note down her China number.

Haha, if there was a call from her or if she come back, actually l do have alot of things l wan to talk and tell her.

xyz1001

08-11-2008, 02:35 PM

I always like to kaypo.......

a samster used 2 tell me, say beh tahan leh, they all look so 楚楚可怜, yet so pritty.......cant just bring myself 2 go n pat my backside n go hm 4get it.

So my siggy was intended for him. But he is not the only 1 whom falls into such category:p

人在江湖，身不由己。不入江湖，何来“身不由己”？

Hmmm... But...

不入红尘，如何 “看破红尘” :p

DO_YOU_BJ

08-11-2008, 06:32 PM

人在江湖，身不由己。不入江湖，何来“身不由己”？

Hmmm... But...

不入红尘，如何 “看破红尘” :p

Agrees bro.....everything has a price!
Life...oh life hahahaha
Well said bro....

colins

08-11-2008, 08:30 PM

人在江湖，身不由己。不入江湖，何来“身不由己”？

Hmmm... But...

不入红尘，如何 “看破红尘” :p

Wah lau eh...simplistic sia! While anyone can choose not to enter 江湖 (and save the troubles of getting KCed), not everyone can enter 红尘 and yet 看破. Fact is, most of us are still in 江湖/红尘 waiting to 看破! hahaha

DO_YOU_BJ

09-11-2008, 07:25 AM

破了。。。。。什么都破了！呵呵

DTCEPL

10-11-2008, 09:33 AM

破了。。。。。什么都破了！呵呵

空即是色,色即是空!

EtherC

10-11-2008, 10:00 AM

I haven't mastered the art of fucking air.

空即是色,色即是空!

DTCEPL

10-11-2008, 10:03 AM

I haven't mastered the art of fucking air.

Good one Bro EtherC:D.........it doesn't mean fucking the air lah......but I like your interpretation, whahahaha

Wooden_Handle

04-12-2008, 01:36 AM

Allowed me for simple thought on the meaning: to me it means sex alone in relationship is empty.

空即是色,色即是空!

DTCEPL

04-12-2008, 08:52 AM

Allowed me for simple thought on the meaning: to me it means sex alone in relationship is empty.

Well, whatever you feel it is, it is;)

Whatever you feel it is not, it is not.

shanshen

04-12-2008, 03:56 PM

u all really sibei good! can turn into buddha chant...ornitorfu....

when a couple in love and have sex, its lovers sex
when a couple not in love but have sex, its obligatory sex
when a couple force the other unwilling into sex, its force sex
when one drug the other and sex her, its rape

so when one pay $ for sex, its commercial sex

so what type of sex is most fun?

i guess most will choose the first one. tio bo?

so most guys after loosing the touch and feel in marriage, tends to seek back the wonderful feelings that they lost by hooking up a lover and seeking the revive the wonderful feelings again... or even if the feeling is still there in marriage, the excitment of "tao jiak" with a lover is also darn sexciting..and too powerful to forgo...i shold say all men love this type of feelings..
whether they admit it openly or not..

Wooden_Handle

05-12-2008, 01:15 AM

Thank you Bro for input, as it is a buddhist phrase, I think we must look for heavenly pleasure instead of bodily pleasure..:)

Well, whatever you feel it is, it is;)

Whatever you feel it is not, it is not.

DTCEPL

05-12-2008, 08:44 AM

Thank you Bro for input, as it is a buddhist phrase, I think we must look for heavenly pleasure instead of bodily pleasure..:)

Heavenly pleasure through bodily pleasure:D - by having great sex. You f**k and screw like mad until shiok shiok and feels like in 7th Heaven:p

Kidding lah......no offence meant to Buddhism

Wooden_Handle

07-12-2008, 12:16 AM

Such a coincidence, I had the heavenly pleasure when XF riding me today, absolute shiok shiok and ...... end :p

Heavenly pleasure through bodily pleasure:D - by having great sex. You f**k and screw like mad until shiok shiok and feels like in 7th Heaven:p

black_secret

16-12-2008, 12:21 AM

Holy cow. Looks like i'm not alone.

U see, i've evolved from "f and forget" to "f with feelings (to WL la)". New chapter in life?? Part of growing up (or old, hehe)?

Randi_Candi

17-12-2008, 02:49 PM

人在江湖，身不由己。不入江湖，何来“身不由己”？

Hmmm... But...

不入红尘，如何 “看破红尘” :p
难道要自己断了手，才知道痛是啥？:confused:
Actually it was intended for those who blamed situations and weak minds for how things turned out. If you think you can't help it, I am sure you can jolly try to avoid it.

Getting out of KC is easier than realising that one's action might have caused people unhappiness and no matter what monetary price one pays will not equate a life of unhappiness and remorse, a price that will weigh forever.

IF they can see this, then I am sure they will realise the real meaning of my siggy

haoyunqiqi

17-01-2009, 08:58 PM

Thanks for helping!

linixx

30-01-2009, 04:14 AM

Had a rude "awakening" only just now from this KC thingie.

I had just turned into commercial sex since Nov last year, all the while being "bonded" by religion, until I lost faith in the whole thing.

Had already tried about a dozen different FLs, so far no RTFs except for this one which I RTF 5 times already, record being 3 times in 8 days. Normally with all the FLs I tried, they would always comment on my "long time to cum" problem, except for this one, she was very accomodating to me, and morever she can speak my dialect language which made me very comfortable with her. As with most RTFs, the feeling just got better and better, and normally she would accompany me for almost the entire room booking timing if she had no bookings (even she has, she will still acompany me for more than an hour). Actually she had started to KC me eariler on when she mentioned if she could be my GF, and actually subsequently I felt like a session with a GF as on numberous times I forgotten to pay until I was snapped back to reality (I still pay up before we parted our ways from the session).

When she mentioned that her business had "slowed" down, since I had not the means "financially" (I did ensure that I would give tips for every session), I tried to help out in other ways possible. Actually deep down I know I'm already addicted to her, trying to help her in all possible ways (using a lot of my brain cells for that).

However tonight I had a rude awakening (actually yesterday I just had a enjoyable session with her), when I found out that all I have done for her is in vain, to her, I'm just a "prawn" on her chessboard. For all the efforts I've been putting in, she is just paying "lip service" on how much she "appreciates".

Although the thought of it "hurts" me much, but I suppose it is something we must all learn. The "powers" of these ladies of the night are too good that a good number of SG men, like myself, are unable to "defend" against.

During our working hours, we are all too aware of mind games that people play, but I guess we do not bring this "awareness" into our choinging trips, that led to the "downfall" of many. Although the phrase "Pay & Fxxx off" always echos in our mind, but how many of us actually practise it? Must we learnt in the hard way (kenna KCed), by "experiencing" it, before we are finally "enlightened", well I'm afraid that applies to me. Luckily I got to learn this lesson early, that I'm still able to "extract" myself from the "mud".

Sorry for my lengthly 0.02cts, just putting out my thoughts into words to express my feelings and hope that other bros are able to see the light and not "fall" into something similar.

cablesnwires

30-01-2009, 09:56 AM

However tonight I had a rude awakening (actually yesterday I just had a enjoyable session with her), when I found out that all I have done for her is in vain, to her, I'm just a "prawn" on her chessboard. For all the efforts I've been putting in, she is just paying "lip service" on how much she "appreciates".

What do you expect? Exclusivity? There is no way, unless you have the means to support her. Remember she's here to make money.

Although the thought of it "hurts" me much, but I suppose it is something we must all learn. The "powers" of these ladies of the night are too good that a good number of SG men, like myself, are unable to "defend" against.

I think the mindset of being a gf is entirely different between the 2 of you. To you, it means that you have the exclusive rights of her. But to her, you are just another bf who is able to help her. I'll give her the benefit of the doubts that she treated you better than her customers. But at the end of the day, she's here to make money, be it for her bf back home, her family or even herself.

Unless you accept the above, you will find yourself full of disappointment and bitterness in any r/s with a WL.

KonKam

30-01-2009, 11:11 AM

Couldn't agree with u more!!

Think all human like that...
When couple in love..........sex is always the wonderful thing until get married.....then sex life reach the stage of decline usually if u got kid or no kid after a long time..

and i can confirm that it always nice to have "FUN" with new girl or even married lady...etc
coz it is exciting...like forbidden fruit....

u all really sibei good! can turn into buddha chant...ornitorfu....

when a couple in love and have sex, its lovers sex
when a couple not in love but have sex, its obligatory sex
when a couple force the other unwilling into sex, its force sex
when one drug the other and sex her, its rape

so when one pay $ for sex, its commercial sex

so what type of sex is most fun?

i guess most will choose the first one. tio bo?

so most guys after loosing the touch and feel in marriage, tends to seek back the wonderful feelings that they lost by hooking up a lover and seeking the revive the wonderful feelings again... or even if the feeling is still there in marriage, the excitment of "tao jiak" with a lover is also darn sexciting..and too powerful to forgo...i shold say all men love this type of feelings..
whether they admit it openly or not..